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nobody
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 3:49 am

or I could buy the next one for the ps3.

If you get dragons dogma we can do some cross play stuff on that. since I do have DD on ps3

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Mitchell
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 4:07 am

My 3 hardest bosses would have to be 1. Anor Londo boss 2. Final boss 3. possibly stray demon ?

If I was being honest, most of the rest of the bosses weren't that hard. Many I beat first try (probably because I could take a few hits to learn their move sets quickly).

Referring to your build nobody I would have to agree with Monkey, as long as you are good with the dodging and have patience so as to not get hit, you shouldn't find it too bad. I had a funny/annoying moment with the boss, I realized I wasn't prepared so came back a gameplay hour later with a much better weapon, used a summoned NPC in the battle and still butchered it in the dying seconds. Beat him the second time by myself so I am proud of that I guess Razz .
My character was only under 50% burden and I was originally using an elemental weapon that the boss resisted so was doing barely any damage. If I had a more appropriate weapon the battle would've been much less troublesome. Then again, part of the game is to learn this stuff for next time Smile .

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nobody
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 4:13 am

I take the trial and error approach. I die so many times, but it doesnt really bother me. I just keep going and going, what really gets to me though is having to do a bunch of mundane stuff just to get to the boss.

so far nothing has come close to some of ninja gaidens toughest fights. thses bosses are easy to manipulate once you get it down

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 4:16 am

Dark Souls is hard but in a more strict sort of way imo, if you play the game well and understand how everything works you succeed, mistakes are heavily punished so if you don't make them in the first place the game can't get you.

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CobaltMonkey
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 4:17 am

Stray is only tough if you take him on early. Level 40 can probably walk all over him.

Final boss is cake too if
Spoiler:
 



I didn't find Ninja Gaiden's to be all that tough. Then again, I developed a tendency to wall drop just about everything early on. Laughing Well, that and the Flying Swallow Slash.

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Mitchell
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 4:22 am

I was just careless with the Stray Demon,
Spoiler:
 

I just tanked the final boss, wasn't pretty but it worked.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 4:27 am

Be mindful of spoilers, please. Smile Nobody hasn't fought him yet.

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nobody
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 4:32 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Dark Souls is hard but in a more strict sort of way imo, if you play the game well and understand how everything works you succeed, mistakes are heavily punished so if you don't make them in the first place the game can't get you.
or memorization.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Stray is only tough if you take him on early. Level 40 can probably walk all over him.

Final boss is cake too if
Spoiler:
 



I didn't find Ninja Gaiden's to be all that tough. Then again, I developed a tendency to wall drop just about everything early on. Laughing Well, that and the Flying Swallow Slash.
yea, how did flying swallow do vs alma? I said "ninja Gaiden's toughest fights"

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 11:30 am

With the right timing it worked just fine. Just had to catch her in the tail end of her attacks or she'd dodge it. Magic was more effective though.

Thought you said the tough fights? Laughing
I kid. She was a Dark Souls - Page 17 860619 to learn.

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nobody
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptySun Dec 16, 2012 10:33 pm

genrally speaking she is considered to be very hard. gorwing up my brother would always have me beat her for him. Personally I dont think she is the hardest, but it has been a long time since I have played, so I dont really remember them well enough.

But I dont feel like any enemy compares to the spider ninja clan enemies. they were ridiculous. I have yet to encounter an enemy where after enough practice it is so easy to slaughter them. It pretty much becomes an afterthought. I dont even need to think about what to do. enemies like the spider ninja clan enemies were always a challenge. there was no easy way to exploit them.


anyways...back on topic, what is annoying me currently is the warriors that shoot "arrows" I suppose thats what they are called, but they are more like ballista. and I have to fight them on such a small ledge, with each of them in opposite directions. got past them on my 2nd try then got owned by a guy with a spear shortly after. only tried a few more times and died, then called it a night. about to give it another shot now

EDIT: wow, talk about cheap. I am fighting a knight with a spear. He almost kills me, so I escape I go out the room through the door and around the corner, and go to use a flask. he attacks me with his spear through the wall and kills me. When there was a ghost that came out of a wall and attacked me and I couldnt attack it, that was understandable as that was a ghost, but when a knight does it, its nothing but cheap, plain and simple

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 12:08 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
genrally speaking she is considered to be very hard. gorwing up my brother would always have me beat her for him. Personally I dont think she is the hardest, but it has been a long time since I have played, so I dont really remember them well enough.

But I dont feel like any enemy compares to the spider ninja clan enemies. they were ridiculous. I have yet to encounter an enemy where after enough practice it is so easy to slaughter them. It pretty much becomes an afterthought. I dont even need to think about what to do. enemies like the spider ninja clan enemies were always a challenge. there was no easy way to exploit them.

anyways...back on topic, what is annoying me currently is the warriors that shoot "arrows" I suppose thats what they are called, but they are more like ballista. and I have to fight them on such a small ledge, with each of them in opposite directions. got past them on my 2nd try then got owned by a guy with a spear shortly after. only tried a few more times and died, then called it a night. about to give it another shot now

There is no topic. Only Zuul.
affraid
Razz
Really though, I'd say that drawing a comparison to a similar game is on topic.

Ninja Gaiden was a faster paced game (which I need to play again, thanks for that). Not even people with the ninja flip ring can hope to keep up with Ryu.
Besides which, the spider ninja (and pretty much everything else in that game) tended to be thrown at you in large numbers. And from dodgy fixed camera angles. Try running through a level gathering up a bunch of enemies and randomly moving the camera in Dark Souls and I'll bet the challenge ramps up too. Laughing
I will agree though. Dark Souls is about learning to manipulate the little enemies and react to the bosses. Ninja Gaiden was as well, but less so and much faster. Before long it could become pretty routine too, if you let it. Wall drop, flying swallow, roll, jump, guillotine throw, flying swallow, ground stab, charge attack, repeat. But despite that it was still an adrenaline rush because you did it all so fast. Dark Souls bosses require care and good timing, but (excluding possibly the DLC ones) can only come close to requiring the split second precision of the harder fights like Alma and (I think) Spirit Doku.
Dang it, I really do need to play that again. I've got Sigma, but they stupidly didn't fix the freezing issues when they ported it from the X-box. I think that's what made me quit my playthrough on the hardest difficulty not long after Spirit Doku. Stupid thing would freeze 2/3 of the time when I went to load it, and I had to reload it a lot.


Ah, the infamous Anor Londo Archers. Condolences. Laughing
Everyone has trouble with this at some point or another. Me? I sailed by them on my first try, and I believe, died to an invader moments later. Anor Londo's a real hot spot for those.
After that I tried forever to get through again. Made it eventually, but it just seemed like I couldn't catch a break. To that point in the game, reaching the bonfire inside there was perhaps the best feeling I'd had.


Just saw your edit. That's not cheap...it's bad programming. All I can say is use it to your advantage like anything else. Shrug Other than that, we can pretty much just hope they fix it in the next title.

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nobody
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 12:42 am

ninja gaiden doesnt have a fixed camera. you use LT to center it behind you. Control of your camera is an important skill to master, and can quickly be set to what ever angle you want in NG as opposed to most games where it is a slow turn with the right stick.

the biggest difference between NG and dark souls is the speed. in dark souls you can see everything coming and react to it for the most part. NG requires great reflexes. also I dont ever remember any freezing issues.

the archers are just plain stupid. I dont feel like there is really even a legitimate strategy to fighting them. just get close, and have them run off the edge. I actually think they would be much more challenging if they were on a more open space where they wouldnt fall off. its not the archers that get me its the spear guy inside. are you saying there is a bonfire right inside? because I have gotten past the archers 5 or 6 times, and I just go in the right and try to kill the spear guy. also I just hit level 50 and have 40 dexterity. I think im going to take end up to 40 next, then alt between res and vit til they are both at around 30. then I'll build up int or faith and add some caster options, but that may be a while off.

how do you tkae advantage of enemies attacking you through walls? there is literally no up side to it for you. I really hope in the next game that the AI attacks will bounce off walls like yours do.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 1:22 am

Important thing!
Don't put points into Res. Ever. It doesn't work right. Can't recall the specifics.Ignored it for so long that I'd forgotten about that. Should have said something sooner.

You can take advantage of attacking through walls yourself. But your weapon has to be long enough, like his spear. There are plenty of enemies that you can get a cheap shot on that way if you so choose. They're going to do it to you in instances like that, so why not?

I'm sure there's a bonfire there.
If you keep going into the room with the knight, and don't find the bonfire, then it's probably not in that room. Laughing

There are several legit ways through the archers. Parry, certain effective spells, timed rolls, etc.

NG's cameras are a mix. It usually follows behind you, but it will also switch angles at certain points, often after walking through a door, but other times as well. You can quickly center it, but center isn't always where it needs to be pointed right off.

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nobody
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 1:47 am

res boosts various defenses does it not? the stats it shows increasing gets increased doesnt it?

based on other previous comments I have made since getting this game do you think I am going to resort to attacking through walls?

I know the bonfire is not in that room. there is only a chest. I am not trying to kill him to get to the bonfire. but if there is one right near by then I'll go find that then go fight him.

you cant parry or even block when you'll just get shot in the back. and I said to fight them, not to get past them. kicking them off a ledge would be a legit way to do it. but them trying to attack you or chase after you and falling off the ledge due to poor AI programming is cheap. as far as rolls, yea I use them all the time to get to them. I do find the inconsistency to be aggravating though. Some times I will be a good 20 feet away and they will stop shooting me and switch to a sword and come get me. Other times I will literally run up and attack them several times and they will continue shooting at me immune to being hit stun, and shoot me. not to mention the fact that it is impossible to look at both at the same time. I cant fight one and look out for arrows coming from the back. I just got genuinely angry for the 1st time in a very long time. generally I just get frustrated, but I actually got so frustrated it turned into anger, and the logic part of my brain shutdown. That hasn't happened in over 5 years. It was kind of an interesting experience just now.

thats why you click the left stick to turn him the direction you want the camera to face then center it. like I said it takes a bit of skill. Having good control of the camera is an essential skill. once you get really good with it, you shouldnt have a bad camera angle for more then a split second

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 2:37 am

It's just like Dark Souls. It's not skill to know which way the enemies are coming from, it's experience. One they're on you'll know where they came from next time. Then you can center it right away.

No, I doubt you will attack through walls. Your choice. Mine? Well, if enemies couldn't, then I wouldn't either.

I know you know it's not in that room. The point is that you kept going in there anyway instead of looking for it.

Res does increase stats, but not enough more than simply increasing anything else to justify putting points in it. If you could put one point in Dex and get 1 point to all your resistances and up your damage, then why put it in Res and get just 2 points to your resistances?

To keep the arrows out of your back you have to listen for them and estimate when to roll. That's all you can do. If you get up to where the right one is, then the left one loses line of sight on you.
They are not immune to staggering. You're just not doing enough damage and Poise damage quickly enough. Silver Knights have wear heavy armor that has high Poise. High Poise allows you to take more damage before you stagger. It would work for you too, but I assume you're still wearing light armor which always has low Poise. You may have the Wolf Ring which would help, but probably not enough to tank an arrow. Those, unfortunately, deal heavy Poise damage.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 2:59 am

never been killed in NG from not knowing where an enemy is coming from. I was talking about quick adjusts on the fly mid combat. if its out of combat then the camera doesnt really matter all that much

i dont think i'll even end up equipping a spear or any type of weapon that I could

I didnt think there would be another bon fire so close. it wasnt about going in that room vs looking for a bon fire, it was about going in that room and fighting that knight vs skipping him and continuing on, which I wasnt ready to do.

because i feel like upping my resistances, and the dexterity would already be past 40. res would basically be the very last stat id increase.

no that doesnt break line of sight. I tried that once or twice. took arrows to the back which sent me off the edge. I have been trying to run left get close enough to the knight there to get his attention, he tries to follow and falls off the edge.

I was wondering how super armor worked in this game. it seems to be at certain damage points (apparently based off poise stat) it never recovers though does it?

no i dont have that ring

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 3:20 am

I have been killed that way. Couple times. Mostly in the Library section, if I recall correctly. And the sewers.


I don't think it recovers, just resets.

Dexterity was just an example. Believe me, the points are always better spent on stats that matter. End, Vit, or if you want to not focus on Str/Int/Faith you can just splash them. 15-20 Int/Faith gets you several utility spells/miracles, for example. Pretty much anything's better than Resistance.
And, I'm not 100% that the stat actually works. I think it didn't at launch, and I'm not certain whether or not any of the patches fixed that. Like I said, I've never missed it, even on my Mage character with barely any armor, all of it light.

I meant the Knight on the right. I've never been shot in the back once I was right up on him. If he comes toward you a ways, yeah, but not if you get close to where he starts. I generally ignore the one on the left because of this. He's not guarding anything important. Useful, but not at all rare.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 3:37 am

there is a difference between being ambushed in dark souls and being ambushed in NG. in dark souls the ambush is more than half the fight. in NG it is only the opening. the ambush wont generally decide if you live or die as much as how you deal with the fight after

what causes it to recover before it is lost?

I was talking about the one on the right. 1st time I went took out the one on the left picked up the hero soul, but then after that I tried going right up to the one on the right and got shot in the back.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 3:50 am

It decides it if you happened to be at low health. Then again, NG also freezes time while you're in the menu and the healing is instant, I believe. Very fitting for that fast paced gameplay, as Dark Souls' tactical healing is to its.

Had to go look it up. I was wrong, it does regen just like a hidden stamina bar. Quoting the wiki, but no spoilers, of course.
Quote :
Poise is a value that determines your resistance to being stunned. Being hit drains poise which regenerates after a moment, much like a hidden stamina bar. When Poise is completely drained, you become stunned. Having one more point of poise than is being dealt will prevent you from being stunned by that hit.

Different weapons drain varying amounts of Poise, and it is completely independent of damage. Generally, larger weapons drain more poise per hit and 2-handing weapons drain more poise.

As for getting shot in the back... Shrug Like I said, never happened to me. Much like you say you've never been killed in an NG ambush. Just different experiences, I guess.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 6:33 pm

I tried it again, got shot in the back, then turned around to see his line of sight, and it was blocked he didnt have one. he mustve shot me through the damn wall.

also got past it, if only I would of gone left instead of right 1st. would of saved me so much trouble.

Now I am not sure where to go. So many areas, and I dont want to go the right way. Also I feel like I am a bit too weak for the area. I dont do enough damage for how much I take. Is there a blacksmith or something not too far ahead that I can get to and upgrade my gear, and still go back and do all this stuff without too much back tracking? also any way to get back to firelink shrine? or do I need to go through londo 1st?

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 8:27 pm

Quote :
also got past it, if only I would of gone left instead of right 1st. would of saved me so much trouble.
You have no idea how much restraint it took to not just tell you. Laughing

There is a blacksmith within this area, but he's about as far away from the bonfire as you can get. You don't have to fight the boss first or anything though, so there's that. The silver knights are easy enough to backstab to death, so I'd just try to do that until you can reach him.

You can return to previous areas, though a significant shortcut will open up after the boss fight.
To just leave the castle you can open the front door.
To get back to Sen's Fortress just go back to where you started.


Making some progress in the new DLC areas. Found some new spells I can't use, and a pyromancy I'll be trying out soon.
Also some carvings that say stuff when you use them. So far I've found an "I'm sorry." a "Help me!" a "Thank you!" and a "Good luck." Sort of like verbal Gestures.
Two of I don't know how many bosses are down. Nothing too troublesome. Kind of expected more out of the second one after hearing how hard he was.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyMon Dec 17, 2012 10:34 pm

I cant go back the way I came. I was dropped off by flying creatures.

Also is the bonfire in firelink supposed to be out when I come back from killing quelog? because it was. Cant use that fire anymore.

ive only been able to get a consistent backstab when they do their lunge attack. Cant get it in when they do any other. havent been able to back stab the spear users at all. but the biggest issue is the egyptian looking enemy

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyTue Dec 18, 2012 12:47 am

Egyptian? I'm not sure what you mean. Really, really big headless guy like the one outside the church blacksmith? He's optional and easy to return to.
Only other things I can think of around are silver knights and giants.

Those flying creatures are still there. Go back to where they dropped you off at (once you open the door, of course) and Talk to them. They'll take you back.

It sort of is.
This should definitely be suitably vague, but I'll spoiler it anyway.
Spoiler:
 

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyTue Dec 18, 2012 4:34 am

yes, apparently they are called titanite demons. the symbol on their back is of egyptian origin.
Spoiler:
 

no i didnt check on anyone underneath. all I know is the guy I got pyromancy is gone, as is the guy who originally told me about the bells as well

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Souls   Dark Souls - Page 17 EmptyTue Dec 18, 2012 5:01 am

I can tell you that those things all happened for different reasons.

Did some more digging into the Resistance stat.
Apparently it doesn't do diminishing returns the same way other stats do. It's based off of your total Soul Level.
Let's say you're level 10 with a Resistance stat of 5. You decide to put a point into Resistance and it gains you 3 points to defense (and very minor bumps in fire and poison resist, though never as much as even the lightest armor).
Now let's say you're level 50 with that same 5 Resistance. Putting a point in it there nets you only 1 point to defense.

Also, it's apparently not completely useless, but only becomes useless in the long run. Anyone not planning a second playthrough or to PvP can get some mileage out of it.
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